Clearly all we have to do is cut taxes. Then receipts will go up, right?

Automatic tax cuts in a recession.

In effect exactly the same thing as interest rate cuts - not collecting revenue to pay for your operations is basically another form of stimulating the economy via inflation (which will be required to pay of the debts incurred).

Again, all these solutions amount to exactly what we've been doing for years now.

The history of fiat currencies and inflation have predicted the disastrous outcome precisely.

It's all stimulation by induced psychosis.

hoocoodanode needs a duplicate comment detector. =)

Outlays rose 41% to $321.2 billion from $227 billion, while receipts dropped 28% to $129 billion from $178.8 billion.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AWwQsdHMT7Y

I come to rest in the middle of the street
a bunch of empty beer cans rattlin' at my feet
starin' in the window is a nosy little brat
I look him in the eyes and say "I meant to do that"
then I notice my watch says I'm overdue
for my big appointment at the local drive through
I do a number on the accelerator
and I'm cuttin' in line about thirty seconds later
whaddya think this is?
some kinda joke?
gimme 10 Big Macs and a small diet coke
I pull up to the window with my radio playin'
I grab the bag and leave without payin'
I weave down the road for a block
jugglin' a beer and a a styrofoam box
pull into a parking lot and kill the motor
presently I notice a peculiar odour
a little black smoke is risin' from the hood
somethings gonna happen and it's probably not good
I open the door grab my stuff and go
just in time to watch the whole thing blow
the car explodes with a bang and a hiss
Oh boy, my wife is gonna really like this
I can't believe this is happenin' to me
this piece of junk's goin' back to the factory
this was a blatant attempt on my life
everyone will fall for that
except my wife

how long does the smoke and mirrors show last?

I lost my middle class tax cut around here. Anybody seen it?

Can we say Federal Taxes paid is cliff diving, or would that be rude?

What would happen if, theoretically, we were to round up and execute the richest 1% and their inheritors and use that money to pay down the government debt? Then a new group of plutocrats would move up, but at least it would be against a debt free backdrop for the People.

Rinse. Repeat. Every fifty years or so.

luckily, all those guys collecting unemployment will have taxes due on it, so we can continue being the greatest country on earth a bit longer

"Outlays rose 41%..., while receipts dropped 28%..."

LOL. What is the next brilliant move going to be?

Who needs to tax when Ben can just print?

Can you imagine all those stupid nations throughout history that put so much effort into collecting taxes not realizing that all they had to do to be successful was to stop doing it?

Thanks to the genius of modern economics and politics we now know better.

"The glimmer of hope is that anyone, anywhere is paying any taxes at all."

I just got assigned to a bankruptcy, so I'll be paying taxes.

Shhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh.......

WASHINGTON (AP) - Federal regulators have told the nation's largest banks not to discuss the government's stress tests of their books over fears investors could punish companies that don't tout the results.
In letters to the 19 banks undergoing tests of their financial strength, regulators told the companies not to disclose their performance during upcoming earnings announcements, according to industry and government officials who requested anonymity because they are not authorized to discuss the process.
If banks receiving the highest marks trumpet their results, the fear is investors might push down share prices of those companies that make no such announcements.
The stress tests are a centerpiece of the Obama administration's ongoing effort to stabilize the banking industry. They subject the banks' books to a series of negative scenarios, including double-digit unemployment and further drops in home values.
The test results will help regulators determine which banks are strong enough with current subsidies, which need more money from the government or private investors, and those not worth saving.
The letters follow public statements from bank executives about the tests, including Wells Fargo & Co. Chief Executive Richard Kovacevich's calling the process "asinine." Bank of America Corp. CEO Kenneth Lewis and Citigroup Inc. CEO Vikram Pandit both have alluded to strong performance on separate, internal stress tests in recent memos seeking to build employee confidence.
Lewis also told reporters last month he expects Bank of America to pass the government's tests.
Wells Fargo has received a $25 billion government bailout; Bank of America and Citigroup each received $45 billion.
Spokesmen for the Federal Reserve and Bank of America would not comment on the issue. Citigroup representatives did not respond to requests for comment. Wells Fargo spokeswoman Julia Tunis Bernard said the company doesn't comment on discussions with regulators.

Defense Secretary Robert Gates' proposed cuts, announced this week, mean uncertainty for workers in an industry many assumed was safe as long as the nation remained at war. While the proposed $534 billion defense budget adds $21 billion to spending in 2009 and some contractors could gain, thousands of defense workers may join growing jobless lines.
Of course, the potential pain depends whether members of Congress, with jobs in their districts at stake, will go for Gates' plan.
Some lawmakers are voicing opposition, and analysts doubt Congress will agree to cut big programs when unemployment is already high. And many defense workers are politically active through unions such as the International Association of Machinists Local 709 in Marietta, which has a "Vote Obama" poster behind the front desk.

I had no idea that individuals pay so much more tax when compared to corporations. I find that kind of disgraceful, myself.

--------------------

What difference does it make when it's going to be taken out of your hide anyway through lower salaries/higher costs for consumer goods. In that regard there's little difference between taxing the corporation and taxing the individual. Not to mention heavily taxing corps would just make cause them to flee to foreign shores where it's cheaper to operate.

ok go to the Fed tax estimator and do the math... it says I should be paying 4100 in fed taxes this year (yes I'm poor) as a single woman. Now I go and look at my last check stub to estimate how much I've paid so far to see where I stand. My remitance says I paid no fed tax on my 4-1 statement. Ummm how is that tax break going to work again?

The concept of a 'jubilee' is a more peaceful implementation of that idea.

//What would happen if, theoretically, we were to round up and execute the richest 1% and their inheritors and use that money to pay down the government debt? Then a new group of plutocrats would move up, but at least it would be against a debt free backdrop for the People.
Rinse. Repeat. Every fifty years or so.//

Nades that's outrageous. If we were to simply tax individuals and excess retained earnings, we'd have to tax the individuals who own the companies at ordinary tax rates and (more importantly) we'd need fewer accountants.
What will all those people manipulating interstate and international transfer pricing do then...huh?

Where have all the old timers gone?

BTW, LawyerLizinMI? If you're in MI, you're probably working on a BK too.

if the corporation is a beneficiary of the state, why shouldn't it support the costs of the state?
if it were untaxed, it should be forced to disgorge all earnings as compensation or dividends that should not be given preferential tax treatment

If you are an individual working outside the country, you still pay taxes. If you are a corporation working outside the the US, you pay none, right?

Great movie called "The Corporation". I recommend it to all

Not yet.. but soon.. maybe

____________________
Where have all the old timers gone?
Some are in Hell!
http://afterthecrash.net - Home of the Doomer Story Portal and Other Stuff

OK, it's 4PM on a Friday and my files just came in. Have a great weekend all.

Nades,

I could get behind eliminating taxes for corporations. Especially if the quid pro quo were getting corporations out of campaign finance.

srvbeach21 wrote on Fri, 04/10/2009 - 12:06pm.

Clearly all we have to do is cut taxes. Then receipts will go up, right?

Tax receipts will "set a record" if we cut taxes.

cyntax, no, the idea isn't to just hold the hammer over "people IN corporations." There's already a body of law to deal with that, and I don't think it's particularly bad. The idea is to hold the corporation's OWNERS personally responsible for the corporation's liabilities. Big difference. In the case of banks, this'd effectively make banks better capitalized.

lawyerlizinMI (member) wrote on Fri, 04/10/2009 - 1:18pm.
So he really was Ladhe? Naaaahhh, you're snarking me.

So what did CSC did for a living? Didn't you ever wonder? I mean, that's a lot of green to obtain all that green.

Cyntax: it's even more fascinating. In the case, a rascally former Supreme Court Justice, if I recally correctly, was brought in to the Santa Clara case to provide clarification of the courts deliberations. He read things from a diary buttressing a debate on the language and whether rights should be afforded to 'persons' or 'citizens' and said persons was decided on to include corporations. But there has been considerable doubt placed on this guy's word and many suspect he invented the diary whole-cloth to give his remembering of the earlier ruling weight. There is some dispute as to the original 14th not getting copied correctly by a secretary and the word citizen being replaced during transcription. The founding fathers were anti-corporate, hence the word does not appear in the Constitution in large part because of their experiences with the East India Trading Company and the Virginia Company, the latter which enforced law in Jamestown as a sort of medieval fascist state complete with torture.

I need "no stinking taxes"...

I wondered and lurked during CSC's days and miss his posts.

"if you don't have a place to call your own, what good is free speech, freedom to practice your own religion, to assemble, or to print up and distribute your own pamphlet, newspaper, etc.? If you don't own property, you are POWERLESS"

LOL!

Renters were tarring and feathering property owners 237 years ago in Boston.

@blackhalo

True with all the money going to banking what about other capital investment, alt energy etc.

The negative feedback loop

Capital diverted to banks-> Diverted from business/consumers -> Real economy deteriorates ->Banks Balance sheet worsens

Repeat Cycle.

Taxing Corps is the only way they can get any money out of the poor! All Corp tax does is give J6P a whipping boy to blame. Ad all the Hidden taxes and lots of people have about 35 cents of spendable dollar.

Here is Lincoln's complete quote in the context of the letter to Colonel Elkins:

"We may congratulate ourselves that this cruel war is nearing its end.
It has cost a vast amount of treasure and blood. . . .
It has indeed been a trying hour for the Republic; but
I see in the near future a crisis approaching that unnerves me and causes
me to tremble for the safety of my country. As a result of the war,
corporations have been enthroned and an era of corruption in high places
will follow, and the money power of the country will endeavor to prolong
its reign by working upon the prejudices of the people until all wealth
is aggregated in a few hands and the Republic is destroyed.
I feel at this moment more anxiety for the safety
of my country than ever before, even in the midst of war.
God grant that my suspicions may prove groundless."

The passage appears in a letter from Lincoln to (Col.) William F. Elkins, Nov. 21, 1864.

new thread

Yo sum of all evil banking, fact check...
http://www.snopes.com/quotes/lincoln.asp

Michael, you say, "The funniest part about this this the Chinese know they are never going to get paid back." But at least they (the Ruling Party) don't have a revolution on their hands. If I were them, I'd do the same thing. Why worry about getting paid back in devalued dollars five years ago, when I can at least maintain power for the time being.

Some of this corporate shortfall is the ability of corporations with a current year loss to "reach back" and receive cash now for taxes paid in the last two years. Don't I wish that I could do that this year, but I dont write $10,000 checks to congresswhores. I have read projections that the growing unemployment will decrease SS contributions so much that the tipping point into SS deficit may come as early as next year. Another black hole for the budget deficit going forward.

Are we starving the beast?

Oh...and the Chinese soon will have no choice in the matter. If we stop buying...they stop lending. Chinese purchases of US assets were always an outgrowth of our purchases of their goods. The current stock market rally and the generally accepted media mantra that the worst has passed are complete delusion.

SPI @ 12:48

You're correct.

But it's amazing how few people realize that you are.